Hungary, like Greece, is referred to as the most important ally of Russia among the countries of the European Union. However, the governments of these countries justify their flirting with Vladimir Putin simply – protection of national interests. The Glavkom tried to look deeper into the matter.
The war in Ukraine significantly affected trade between the two countries, and Hungary’s losses from sanctions imposed by the EU against Russia made the country’s leadership maneuver between the common interests of the EU and the policy of protection of the domestic market from losses. Predicting this, in 2014, the Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban said that he did not support sanctions against Russia, but later softened his position somewhat, calling only for careful consideration whether to extend sanctions against Russia because Hungary had lost $ 4 billion due to them.
In Ukraine there is a fairly large Hungarian community – about 150,000 people, according to the last major census, conducted in 2001. Most of them live in Transcarpathian region. It is natural that they are interesting to Ukrainian politicians. On the eve of the last parliamentary elections in Ukraine, the Hungarian community requested the CEC to form constituencies taking into account places densely populated by the Hungarian community, but the CEC denied them. On April 5, the deputies of the Transcarpathian Regional Council appealed to the President regarding the amendments to the Constitution to grant broad administrative and financial powers to local governments, which many interpreted as an attempt to undermine the situation like in the Donbass. One of the vehement opponents of this appeal, in particular, is the head of the Transcarpathian Regional State Administration Hennadiy Moskal.
Meanwhile, the Hungarian Ambassador to Ukraine Erno Keskeny believes that the Hungarian community has the right to more powers. However, the diplomat says that comparison with the Donbass is inappropriate. He says it does not pose any separatism threats. In an interview with the "Glavkom", the Hungarian Ambassador said how his country helps Ukraine during the war, how many Ukrainians are denied visas at the Hungarian Embassy, why there is still no common Hungarian-Romanian-Ukrainian customs zone, and why Ukrainians will not go en mass to the EU after the introduction of visa-free regime for Ukraine.
– Lately the issue of Syrian refugees has been one of the main problems for Hungary. A month or two ago, the world’s leading television channels made reports on people trying to break to your country over protective walls on the border of Hungary and Croatia. But now there are few such reports. Is the problem in the past?
– Syrian refugees is a challenge not only for Hungary but for the whole of Europe. When tens of thousands of people come at once, it is not a problem of our country only. Of course, Hungary is open to anyone who crosses the border after appropriate check and registration at the border. What is going on at our border is an attempt of illegal crossing. By the erection of the fence (on the border of Hungary and Croatia), we tried to protect the borders of the Schengen area. And now we do not regret it. Although as humans, of course, we sympathize with these people. Where possible, we have helped them with medicine, food, anything we can do. But if in Germany life is better than in the Middle East, it does not mean that all people have to move to Germany now. In our view, to solve the problem, we need to stop the war at these people’s home. The issue should solved where it arose.
– How many refugees are there now in the territory of Hungary, how many of them have received asylum, what is the fate of those who are in "suspended" status?
– Consideration of each case, all the documents takes a lot of time. Today, in Hungary, there are several thousand people who have received refugee status. These people live in refugee camps, they have food, medical care. Either way, the target country for these people is Germany, not Hungary.
– Are there any asylum seekers, who try to become refugees crossing the Ukrainian-Hungarian border?
– Ukrainian border guards have detained a small number of people who tried to cross the Ukrainian-Hungarian border. Those are a few dozen people, less than 100. We can say that the Hungarian-Ukrainian border is under adequate control.
– Some politicians in Europe express concerns that after the introduction of visa-free regime between the EU and Ukraine, thousands of Ukrainian citizens will leave to the EU, creating problems there. Are those concerns justified?
– Hungary is a country that consistently supports the introduction of visa-free regime with Ukraine. We have absolutely no such fears. We know that about 1 million Ukrainians work in Poland, in Hungary, there are tens of thousands Ukrainians. We believe that Ukraine has to do its "homework", introduce biometric passports, take the necessary steps in order to meet the conditions for a visa-free regime. But we have been consistently backing you in this. We are not afraid of influx of people coming to seek employment in Hungary.
– Ukraine and Hungary have signed the Agreement on local border traffic. How many people have the right to simplified border crossing and does this traffic pose any problem for Hungary?
– Our countries have signed the Agreement on local border traffic for strengthening family ties. With the permission for local border traffic, people come to Hungary not to work, but mainly to visit relatives. About one hundred thousand people have permission for local border traffic.
– In an interview with the "Glavkom", the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine Pavlo Klimkin said that the issue of dual citizenship in Ukraine can be solved by creation of a common customs control zone between Hungary, Romania and Ukraine. According to him, it will allow citizens of Ukraine cross the border only with one passport. Why hasn’t it been done yet, and what do they think in your country about this solution of the issue that is problematic for Ukraine?
– The aim of the joint border control is to facilitate border crossing, to facilitate the work of those who work at border crossings, which requires a high level of trust between the two countries. Currently, the Hungarian-Ukrainian border can be crossed at five points. We would like to make more such border crossing points. For example, we would like to open a checkpoint Nagyhodos on our side and Velyka Palad on the Ukrainian side. At this checkpoint, we could arrange joint control. For our part, we are ready to speed up the work for its opening. But it depends not only on the Hungarian party.
– What is the problem?
– On the Hungarian side, the road has been built, plans for arrangement of the joint border and customs control point have been developed, we are still waiting for the road to this potential crossing point to be built on the Ukrainian side.
– Two months ago, April 5, at the session of the Transcarpathian Regional Council, deputies appealed to the President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko on amendments to the Constitution for the purpose of granting broad administrative and financial powers to local authorities. Many politicians in Ukraine regarded this move as separatism, similar to those we saw in the Donbass. Do you see such danger?
– As a diplomat, I do not want to assess the internal political processes. If local residents are concerned about this issue of the specifics of local self-government, they have the right to talk about it. There can be no comparisons with the Donbass. And those, who make such comparisons, do it with bad intent. I do not see any threat of separatism in respect of Transcarpathia. I think that such ideas are spread by people who are interested in it. I want to emphasize once again that Hungary has always been supporting your country. We were among the first to recognize the independence of Ukraine and the first to open the embassy in the independent Ukraine. Recently, our relations have only improved.
– What was the catalyst for improvment of the relations between Ukraine and Hungary?
– Maybe it sounds a little immodest, but the Hungarian Embassy in Ukraine has made significant efforts in order to improve the relations. We have organized many cultural programs and economic forums to improve bilateral relations.
– Before the parliamentary elections in Ukraine, Hungarian State Secretariat for National Policy criticized the formation of constituencies in Transcarpathia by the CEC. They said that the change of the constituencies boundaries comes at the expense of the Hungarian community living in the region. However, in your own words, all political processes are internal processes in Ukraine, which your government has no influence on. Don’t you think that these statements contradict each other?
– Hungarian Secretary of State made this statement after the formation of constituencies. With this statement, the Hungarian State Secretary only noted this fact. Transcarpathian Hungarians wanted to have a constituency including several villages densely populated by Hungarians so that they could elect their own representative of the Hungarian community. But, unfortunately, the CEC did not listen to the request of the Transcarpathian Hungarians.
– The head of the Transcarpathian regional state administration Hennadiy Moskal spoke about the fight against smuggling on the border with Romania, Hungary and Slovakia. How relevant is the problem of smuggling on the Hungarian-Ukrainian border and why, if it is a problem between the two countries, we do not hear about the detained criminals from the Hungarian side?
– Of course, the fight against smuggling is a common task, and both sides are interested in it. This problem exists. Both on the Ukrainian and on the Hungarian sides, the customs officers and the border guards, who were partners in smuggling activities, were fired. Now the situation is better than before, but the fight is not over, it is constatntly going on.
– On the eve of the European Football Championship, there is problem of issuing visas to citizens of Ukraine. Many journalists and public figures openly criticize the French Embassy, accusing the country of discriminatory policies towards the citizens of Ukraine. Are there similar problems with Ukrainians who ask for a visa through the Hungarian consulate, what is the refusal rate?
– Hungary has the embassy in Kyiv, Consulate General in Uzhgorod and a consulate in Beregovo. In addition, there are visa centers in Lviv, Dnipro, Kyiv and Odesa. In fact, a lot of people apply for Hungarian Schengen visas. Last year, the Hungarian Embassy in Kyiv accepted about 40,000 visa applications, the Consulate General in Uzhgorod – about 50,000 applications, the Consulate of Hungary in Beregovo – about 30,000 visa applications. The refusal rate is about 2%.
– During the armed conflict, many countries are helping Ukraine. Your country last year took several dozen Ukrainian soldiers for treatment. Do you plan to continue to provide such assistance, how expensive it is for Hungary?
– Last year we took 20 seriously wounded Ukrainian soldiers for treatment. It was treatment and rehabilitation. This year we have agreed to take the same number – 20 people for treatment and rehabilitation. Now, we are ready to take the first six people, we are still waiting for the response of the Ministry of Defense of Ukraine, but this issue will be settled soon.
Last year, 680 Ukrainian children from families from the ATO area visited Hungary. We also help through Ukrainian public organizations. We are helping not only IDPs, but also individuals who need such help, poor people. The amount of our aid is several million euros.
– It is well known that there is a powerful nationalist movement in your country, many people support the idea of the revival of Great Hungary, such ideas in your country are frequently compared to what is happening in Russia. In your opinion, are those sentiments a threat to both Hungary and to coexistence of your state with the EU?
I do not think that our nationalist movements are stronger than in any other European country. On June 4, we commemorate the Day of National Unity. On this day we remember the Treaty of Trianon, which ended the First World War for our country, and which our nation was forced to sign. Under that agreement, Hungary was divided. But now we do not think of the violent change of the borders that currently exist. At the same time, we want to have good relations with all our neighbors. Meanwhile, it is important and necessary that those 5 million Hungarians living outside Hungary have the same rights that national minorities have in all countries.
– Is Hungary satisfied with the rights Hungarians have in Ukraine?
– The Hungarian minority in Ukraine still has the needs that have not yet been satisfied. The Hungarian government – whose constitutional duty is to support Hungarians abroad – supports these aspirations of the Hungarian minority in Ukraine, for example, the creation of the Hungarian constituency, the creation of the Hungarian educational district, the opportunity to take tests in native, that is Hungarian language, restitution of church property, rehabilitation of Stalin’s terror victims.
– Let’s talk about the economy. After the annexation of the Crimea and the war in Ukraine, the exchange of goods between our country and its neighbors has significantly reduced. How much has the volume of trade between Ukraine and Hungary dropped?
– Yes, due to the crisis, our turnover has decreased. Before the crisis, it amounted to 4.2 billion dollars, last year, it was 2.5 billion dollars. Of course, in order to renew the growth, it is necessary to stop the war in the east of your country. Investors will not go to a country where there is war. In addition, the issue of legal uncertainty in the economy should be settled.
– Back in 2014, before the introduction of sanctions against the Russian Federation, the Prime Minister Viktor Orban said that Hungary did not support their introduction. How has the stance of your country changed over the past 2 years?
– Hungary has always supported the sanctions imposed against the Russian Federation because of its role in the situation that has developed in Ukraine. However, it should be noted that sanctions have caused significant damage to Hungary – the country has lost more than $ 4 billion. Therefore, the Prime Minister of Hungary recently voiced this opinion that Hungary does not want to automatically extend the sanctions and emphasized that the decision to extend the sanctions should be taken after a thorough analysis of the situation.
– It is known that many Hungarian farmers have found a way out. Many Hungarian-Serbian joint ventures have been founded in your country that produce, for example, fruits that then are sold to Russia as Serbian products because Serbia has not introduced sanctions against Russia. Can you say that Serbia saved Hungary, affected by sanctions against Russia?
– It is possible that perhaps such examples exist, but in any case it would be an overstatement to say that this phenomenon is widespread, and it would solve the issue of damage caused to Hungary by sanctions, or even significantly reduce it.
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